More wetting than we think?

[Paul Tester]

Ger's FD site has many pictures of young ladies who have, according to the captions, "peed their pants." This amazes me as I have never seen or known of YL's who do this. Are we seeing only exhibitionists or 'pleasure wetters' who do this to get their picture onto Facebook or is this a case of genuine bladder incontinence? If the latter, are there as many or more females wearing skirts or dresses going about with wet knickers and nobody knows about it???
Does this also explain why I have so rarely seen females in skirts/dresses holding between their legs to control their pee? They would rather have wet knickers that be seen holding?

[Adrian6970]

Paul, I think without exception they're all staged or at least submitted by ladies who wet for pleasure. There are, I know, a few people with genuine continence problems who embrace our fetish as a means of helping to deal with it - so it becomes part of their sexuality. However I suspect such cases are in a minority. I always make a moral distinction between people who wet for pleasure (which turns me on) and people who wet as a result of genuine health problems (which I don't find a particular turnon).

[PP1]

Lots of the social media posts seem to be made by friends of the gal with wet pants. These "friends" are usually other young women who seem to find it humorous or enjoy ridiculing the wetter. I don't think many involve intentional erotic wetting, but we get to fantasize that the wetter secretly enjoys it.

[Hiddenpleasure]

There's always that part of having no choice for the wetter but to overcome the shame, which is exciting on itself!

[Paul Tester]

I admit to liking desperation: the fight to hold back her pee; not wetting, but I have nothing against anyone who prefers wetting. Give the choice I would like to see the struggles of the girl as she tries not to wet, rather than the result.
I am still perplexed by the possible extent of these wettings. How is it that, despite my efforts to see desperation, I have only seen one wetting in progress and the result of so few.
Am I wrong in thinking that many of these wettings are in the USA?

[Betanumeric]

Paul, it's a lot more common than you think: you need to go googling for phrases like 'Prevalence of urinary incontinence in women aged 20-30'.

However, our interest isn't really in women who should see their doctor about a bladder problem - it's about healthy and attractive women who have accidents: there's nothing at all wrong with them, they just got desperate and did something very, very embarrassing.

So here's the hard facts - between 10 and 13.5% of women in their 20's who are otherwise healthy, and who have never had a child, are mildly incontinent - as in: they leak a bit, enough that they need to be careful what they wear; it happens more than once a week; and they've probably pissed themself badly enough that only a diaper would've hidden it, more than once in the last year.

Fewer than half of those women will see their doctor or practice nurse about it, even in countries where healthcare is free.

The 'moderately' incontinent (1.2 to 2.4%, definitions vary, and surveys vary a lot) of otherwise healthy women in their 20's? They have more of a problem: they wear pads and are careful about their fluid intake, they make conscious decisions that limit their social and working lives because of their condition, and most - but not all! - are seeking treatment: I doubt that you and I have any interest in them, other than an honest hope that they get this fixed and live a happier life.

And now the really interesting number: there are surveys of healthy women at college in which 30% admit to 'an involuntary loss of urine' in the last 30 days. How much they lost, we don't know - or at least, I won't know until I gain access to the subscription-only medical journals where the full data sets are available, rather than the 'abstracts' or summaries of the findings - and we have to assume that most of those wetting were minor dribbles and spurts that probably didn't even bother them: damp for moment and nobody knew...

But we can be sure that a few of them were not so minor; and 30% means we're venturing well outside the boundaries of the 10-13.5% who would be diagnosed as having a bladder problem by a doctor. That is to say: about 1 in 5 of all healthy women of college age, who are *not* incontinent, have pissed themselves a teensy little bit in the last 30 days...

...Or more than a teensy little bit. But we don't know how much, or how many.

So I'll leave you with this: go looking for published research (surveys and follow-up work in respectable medical journals) on stress incontinence among women athletes and fitness instructors. You'll find at least one published result, obtained by medical professionals and verified by the journal, that 40% of female aerobics instructors admit to wettting themselves in the last 30 days. That's stress incontinence - high-impact exercise (or stresses like sneezing) - and the losses from that are typically a quarter of the bladder, and sometimes nearly all of it. In other words, a highly visible wetting - clothes won't hide it and there's probably going to be a puddle, not just a wet patch in her clothing.

While a small proportion of women fitness instructors have faces like a bulldog's arse, most are passable or better; and the nature of their work guarantees that they have really, really hot bodies.

And forty percent of them wet themselves visibly this month, and forty percent of them - and about half as many college sportswomen - will do exactly the same next month, and the month after.

That's a really surprising figure.

You won't get many women to admit it in your hearing: not the ones who've done it, and they will all be very susrprised when they hear that the number is that high in the very fittest and healthiest women they have ever met.

You won't get many women to admit it privately among other women - women *use* humiliation in their social pecking-order games, and they are right not to trust each other with that kind of damaging admission.

You will only get those numbers when medical professionals put serious work into privacy and confidentiality and anonymisation, and gain the trust of women in their survey population...

And those numbers are really *that* high. Go look for yourself!

What's unsurprising is that every woman puts a lot of effort goes into *not* being seen having wet herself, and not being photographed when she did: so the number of photos out there on the web is pretty much what I'd expect it to be.

I have an educated guess that a healthy and attractive woman in her 20's, who is not in the 'mildly incontinent' population, has a 2% to 3% chance of wetting herself - as in losing half her bladder or more - every single year.

That's a low percentage - it *sounds* like a very low risk - and a lot of rational people would say "it's so low that I can live my life as if it's zero". So adult women in their 20's can sustain a public pretence that the sight of another woman pissing herself is this astonishing, disgraceful, you-should-never-show-your-face-again moral lapse, that they themselves will never, ever, allow themselves to perpetrate.

And five or ten percent of women in their 20's are a lot more sensible about that, out of necessity - the ones in or just outside the diagostic criteria for incontinence, and rather more are being less than sensible about the fact they really did wet themselves.

So where is the typical woman in her 20's with that 2-3% risk per year?

Ignoring her first experience with alcohol in her teens, and not-so-minor embarrassments when she had cystitis, the chances of her reaching the age of 30 and never having wet herself completely are quite high - about 75% - and most women in their 20's will truthfully claim that they have never wet themselves as an adult.

That leaves me guessing that a quarter of all women probably did piss themselves in at least once in their 20's - soaked, sopping wet, sitting or standing in a puddle of piss.

Am I definitely right? I'm in-the-ballpark right, but that's all: go check for yourself.

I really *do* encourage you to find your own numbers and set out the areas of guesswork where you and I disagree. You probably will. But if you think I'm out by a factor of ten, and only two and a half percent of healthy women ever wet themselves in their twenties, that low-end number is *still* a couple of hundred wettings, every year, in any major city, among socially- and sexually-active young women.

Does that answer your question?

[Paul Tester]

Betanumeric: I good post and lots of interesting data, but.... I am not really interested in ladies who wet themselves through 'stress incontinence.' My interest is in ladies who want to pee, but circumstances do not allow them to do so. i.e. Desperation! If they leak a bit them, good. I would rather see, or hear about, a lady who was trying to hold in a vey full bladder, than one who let some pee go due to stress. If all those girls on Ger's site had let their pee go because their bladder was too full to hold any more, that would be great. Maybe they enjoyed letting go, perhaps they just enjoyed the relief. That to me is what Ger's site should be about; not girls with urinary problems that have leaked and then are being publicly embarrassed by their friends. if the prequel to the photo was a lot of leg crossing, and crotch holding to try to prevent to leak, that would be better, for me, than if the prequel was a jump or trip.
I know that a girl with a bursting bladder is more likely to leak from violent exercise that if her bladder was only half full, and how difficult it sir for some to run for the toilet they need so badly, and if they leak then, OK.
Regretfully, I think you have convinced me that much of the Ger wettings are not due to sheer desperation and the subsequent loss of control.
Do these medical journals ever report on experiments to discover the absolute capacity of the female bladder, when urinary release is not allowed?

[Adrian6970]

Paul I think desperation and wetting, whether genuinely accidental or intentional, is much more common than is probably realised. I don't think there are many honest adults who, if pressed on the subject, would deny ever having had an accident or occasionally been so desperate that they only just made it to the toilet in the nick of time. However for societal reasons it's a subject which doesn't get openly discussed much - except occasionally between family members or close friends. The other evening I was getting off a train I overheard a woman saying to her partner something along the lines of, "I've lasted this long, I'm sure I'll last a little longer until we get home." I don't honestly know whether she was referring to a need for the loo or not but, being the sort of person I am, the thought certainly crossed my mind! Those of who post on forums like this are very much in the minority who stick our heads above the parapet and declare an interest. However I'm sure the number of people who find desperation or wetting enjoyable is much. much greater. I've never been to America having so far resisted that particular urge but I understand there's a distinct lack of genuinely public toilets, i.e. ones not attached to bars, eateries or shops, coupled with a latent puritanical attitude to bodily functions, a combination which no doubt makes it a place where desperation and accidents aren't all that uncommon. However I'd be grateful for feedback from USA members about that.

[Cool69002]

Paul, it's a lot more common than you think... and sexually-active young women.

Very interesting and relevant informations. It is not so uncommon for a women to pee herself. I have witnessed some wetting accidents.

As for me, I like all kind of wettings, be it due to a full bladder or stress incontinence, as long as the girl is attractive enough (not necessarily a manequin).

[ppppppp]

Very interesting and relevant informations. It is not so uncommon for a women to pee herself. I have witnessed some wetting accidents.

As for me, I like all kind of wettings, be it due to a full bladder or stress incontinence, as long as the girl is attractive enough (not necessarily a manequin).

Please do describe some of the wetting accidents you have seen.



As I understand it, one of the differences in female anatomy is the shorter length of the urethra. That does result in more leaks. The way the muscles and nervous system work together, when someone badly needs to pee, the actual release (which might be an accidental dribble) triggers the muscles. She leaks, her bladder automatically contracts, the dribble becomes a squirt, and suddenly she realises that she is pissing into her knickers, and cannot stop.

[Paul Tester]

Desperation

I have always believed that desperation, or at leas an urgent need to pee, is far more common than we thing, or even hope. I think that everyone, even those with huge bladders, are fairly often desperate to pee. Most will hold out long enough to get to a toilet in time and nobody will know. Except if we see them making a run for the toilet.
If it was possible to measure the bladder pressure of people entering a public toilet, I bet there would be some with readings 'off the scale.' We do not know about it because they do not show their desperation.
My own experience: I have been in a group where the women have used a public toilet. Nothing unusual about that! But months after I had an intimate relationship with one of those women, who knew of my fetish, and she told me on that and several other occasions, she and other women were "absolutely desperate, and nearly wetting themselves." Despite my interest in this I had no idea at the time.

[Cool69002]

Please do describe some of the wetting accidents you have seen.

When I was young, I witnessed some female weeting accidents:

• A girl, 5 years older than me (about 16) and whom I was secretly in love with, was used to peeing herself out of laughing. Someday she pissed her shorts in front of me. Another was wearing a shorts with a dried damp patch at crotch.
• A 40 year-old blond woman said she peed her pants a few days ago.

When I was a student, I witnessed those accidents:

• When I was a student, I saw a black teen girl pissing her black jeans in front of me. She was embarrassed and her friend was laughing at her. She awkwardly tried to hide the damp patch with a cardboard folder behind her butt.
• I saw a brunette with a soaked blue trousers. She was walking fastly with a guy.
• A 35 year-old woman said she really peed her pants when she saw "The Exorcist" movie.
• I was reported that her sister peed her pants several times : during a party, after a few too many drinks ; in a restaurant ; in another party.

A girl I met on an online dating website told me that she and her (female) friend and she pissed themselves (she was wearing a pink trousers) after drinking too many beers and laughing too hard in the streets.

Another girl I met on an online dating website told me she pissed herlsef during a party. She wore a dress.

One of my ex-girlfriends was so desperate that she peed herself. She wore a dress, panty hose and obviously panties.

Now I will try to share my fetish with my future girlfriends.

[Cool69002]

3 links explaining why women tend to pee themselves when they laugh too hard:
Why do girls pee when they laugh too hard?
I pee a little when I’m laughing, coughing or sneezing; is that normal?
Why do girls pee when they laugh too hard?